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Re: NAHL vs NCDC

NAHL TIER 2
NCDC TIER 3
NAHL has more D1 commits but just as may with nothing to show or a low level d3 comitt
NO GUARENTEES

Re: NAHL vs NCDC

NAHL has less than 30% D1 commits, 20% make rosters, 10% play. Fact. Both leagues are primarily D3 feeder leagues.

Re: NAHL vs NCDC

Anon
NAHL has less than 30% D1 commits, 20% make rosters, 10% play. Fact. Both leagues are primarily D3 feeder leagues.
Local NAHL team is mostly a d3 feeder. As a league overall is a mixture of both D1 and D3. NHL drafts a handful of NAHL players every year. That is pretty telling!

Re: NAHL vs NCDC

Will the NCDC keep local talent next year as kids may not travel to BCHL , NAHL etc?

Re: NAHL vs NCDC

anon
Will the NCDC keep local talent next year as kids may not travel to BCHL , NAHL etc?
Might be fewer outbreaks in Salmon Arm, BC and throughout the NAHL footprint then USPHL in the Northeast

Re: NAHL vs NCDC

NCDC is tuition free Tier 2, not 3.

Re: NAHL vs NCDC

anon
NCDC is tuition free Tier 2, not 3.
It isn't officially Tier II because they aren't USA Hockey sanctioned. It's above Tier III but below Tier II.

WSHL calls itself Tier II as well, but that isn't even above Tier III.

Re: NAHL vs NCDC

This whole model may just fall apart anyway.

USHL and most of the NAHL are able to be tuition free because they actually bring in revenue from selling tickets and most are in areas with way cheaper ice.

NCDC only exists as tuition free because the programs subsidize from squeezing money out of their other youth hockey and tier 3 junior teams.

With economic issues right now both models will suffer but NCDC will suffer the most. Pretty sure you can’t pack 90 mites on the ice at the same time for 3 simultaneous cross ice games anytime soon or cram 3 teams onto one 60 min practice slot for “station based squirt practices” so not as much money to support a tuition free junior league going forward.

Lot of things are going to get tested and landscape probably changes a lot over the next 24 months.

Re: NAHL vs NCDC

Anon
This whole model may just fall apart anyway.

USHL and most of the NAHL are able to be tuition free because they actually bring in revenue from selling tickets and most are in areas with way cheaper ice.

NCDC only exists as tuition free because the programs subsidize from squeezing money out of their other youth hockey and tier 3 junior teams.

With economic issues right now both models will suffer but NCDC will suffer the most. Pretty sure you can’t pack 90 mites on the ice at the same time for 3 simultaneous cross ice games anytime soon or cram 3 teams onto one 60 min practice slot for “station based squirt practices” so not as much money to support a tuition free junior league going forward.

Lot of things are going to get tested and landscape probably changes a lot over the next 24 months.
Wait, what?

So, in your mind, fewer mites and squirts means less "tax dollars." How much less? 10%? 20%? 30%?

How do NAHL and USHL teams collect gate and advertising if no one is allowed to attend games? Or if fans have to social distance in the stands?

Their revenue would be hurt WAY more.

And, NCDC teams don't count on cross ice mites. Most of the "tax dollars" come from midgets and pay-to-play junior. Which will have just as many players as usual. The USPHL has like 60 teams at the junior level now. Tha's a lot of players to tax.

i'm no fan of the NCDC, IMO they've taken steps back the last two years by being stupid. Pigs get fat, hogs get slaughtered. But that may be the more sustainable model, given the unprecedented circumstances.

Re: NAHL vs NCDC

Maybe my assumption each NCDC program only taxes it’s own pay to play junior, midget, youth is wrong. If they are taxing all the USPHL pay to play junior and midget teams that’s a different story but I don’t see why anybody would agree to that. Random USPHL team in wherever that doesn’t have an NCDC team willingly subsidizes the Jr Bruins or SSK? Maybe that’s how it works but would think there are more organizations who don’t have NCDC than who do so why would they agree to do that?

Fair point on ticket sales also being impacted but given most USHL and core NAHL teams are in smaller midwest cities I suspect they open back up faster and because especially USHL is highest level hockey in those cities people keep going to watch. I also have an uninformed view those organizations are run better and better capitalized so having a bumpy season this season doesn’t kill them vs the organizations over here who seem to operate with a much smaller margin for error.

But I don’t know. You may be right and pay to play model does better through this. Will find out soon enough.

Re: NAHL vs NCDC

Anon
Maybe my assumption each NCDC program only taxes it’s own pay to play junior, midget, youth is wrong. If they are taxing all the USPHL pay to play junior and midget teams that’s a different story but I don’t see why anybody would agree to that. Random USPHL team in wherever that doesn’t have an NCDC team willingly subsidizes the Jr Bruins or SSK? Maybe that’s how it works but would think there are more organizations who don’t have NCDC than who do so why would they agree to do that?

Fair point on ticket sales also being impacted but given most USHL and core NAHL teams are in smaller midwest cities I suspect they open back up faster and because especially USHL is highest level hockey in those cities people keep going to watch. I also have an uninformed view those organizations are run better and better capitalized so having a bumpy season this season doesn’t kill them vs the organizations over here who seem to operate with a much smaller margin for error.

But I don’t know. You may be right and pay to play model does better through this. Will find out soon enough.
Every rostered player on those 60+ USPHL Premier teams pays a "league fee." What the league does with that is their business.

BTW, the "tax" concept is no different from how USA Hockey pays for the USNTDP.

Re: NAHL vs NCDC

I guess.

Putting aside the issue of whether it’s appropriate for the USPHL to upcharge all their pay to play guys to subsidize the NCDC which only benefits a few organizations, how far could that fee even really go? What is the player fee? $100 each? I don’t know, my kids are younger, I am a tourist from the youth hockey part of the site and wanted to switch it up from the EHF vs E9 arguments every 10 minutes.

$100 x 20 players x 60 teams is $120k for the entire USPHL tax. That doesn’t cover much. I think there are 13 NCDC teams right? So under $10k a team from that source. So the rest presumably has to come from the specific NCDC’s organization taxing its mites, squirts, et al. right?

I honestly don’t know but think it’s interesting to try to figure out because it seem like the NCDC is already probably hard to support even before all this.

Now if a big part of the NCDC teams budgets are from taxing their own programs then this period of social distancing is going to leave a mark because it crushes the profitability of the younger kids because that’s built on cramming as many kids into an hour of ice as possible and that will be harder to do.

You are closer to it so maybe this is off base but on the outside looking in it looks pretty dicey.

Re: NAHL vs NCDC

$500 a youth player is with the tax is inside each organization.

And whoever the idiot is that calls and CDC tier 2 knows nothing about hockey. Half of the EHL teams would beat most NCDC teams.

Re: NAHL vs NCDC

Mite and squirt parents aren’t paying $500 a player to help fund the NCDC.

Crazy talk.

Nobody would do that.

Re: NAHL vs NCDC

Anon
Mite and squirt parents aren’t paying $500 a player to help fund the NCDC.

Crazy talk.

Nobody would do that.
It's built into your tuition buddy...

Re: NAHL vs NCDC

Many ncdc teams treat their players horribly...expect this to only get worse moving forward. Who would billet a player now, and what happens if that player is traded? Would a host family be willing to bring another stranger into their home without testing? Rockets didn’t provide locker rooms for players, bandits folded and didn’t provide players with sticks. Hard to call yourself Tier II hockey when your financial basis is built upon upcharging youth players who will never be part of the ncdc program.