Instead of little side mentions in several different threads, how about one place where all the info and/or rumors of whats going on next season with USPHL Youth division.

Is the EHF breaking up or just a couple teams moving over or are organizations doing both USPHL and EHF (with elite moving and tier 1 staying ehf)? E9 teams going as well? Does it mean a bunch of travel to NY/NJ or is there going to be a division for just New England? If the EHF breaks up, does a new league start with the remaining teams?

EHF and USPHL are run by the same people. It seems they have realized they can no longer compete with the best programs from the midwest, so they are looking to elevate the USPHL.

It has been announced that the USPHL is going to Tier II. That means a loss of significant revenue, at least initially. Let's call it $200 large - $10,000 per player, 20 players.

So, what the teams that will have Tier II Junior programs will need to do is replace that income. What is circulating through the rinks is that the EHF teams are moving under the USPHL umbrella. Which teams, is a guess right now.

Whether it means they still have a MA/RI/So NH league and supplement with super-regional showcases or not is also not clear. But, what value is there to the stronger EHF teams to waste a weekend playing Top Gun and the Bandits?

My prediction is that the parents of the strongest players from the EHF will be offered spots on a handful of teams - for simplicity, MMF, IHC, SSK, BJE. Maybe it's six teams, not four, I don't know. Maybe the Eagles aren't a part of it since they don't have a Junior program.

The rest of the teams will be in either a lower division or remain in a separate league.

Why would a parent do that? For the opportunity to travel to NY and NJ - or Detroit and Chicago - and play meaningful games every weekend against the best talent in the nation. That's something that you may not have latched onto yet - the parents of the best players don't see super-regional travel as an inconvenience, they see it as an opportunity.

IHC, SSK, BSB and Jr Bruins are already affiliated with the league in the older divisions so thats probably a good starting point.

What happens to the tier 1 ehf teams for the organizations that have elite teams that make the move? Do they get put in a lower division in usphl with the crazy travel or left back in ehf or whatever that league becomes in MA?

Whats the best guess on when any of it will be announced? Or is this all just rumors on guessing how the tuition free junior teams will be paid for?

Stop. Just stop. All nonsense. Get your facts straight.

USPHL and Fed are not owned by the same people.

RG owns USPHL. BB owns Fed.

USPHL youth division is basically tier 2 this year and awful. Half the teams were tier 2 teams last year that tried to move up. Not knocking the organizations but they are not good.

The Fed is a cash cow. Top 4 teams also competes with any team in the country.

What is going to happen is some teams will supplement games and play both. The added 20 games that typically I picked up in tournaments will now just shift to USPHL. Rules are you have to have a junior and youth program to participate. The only local programs that are eligible right now are kings, Islanders and breakers.

Overtime the HP Midwest league will ultimately join and do the same thing. E9 teams will be left in the dark due to turf wars.

Looks like Bandits and Cyclones are joined as well.

http://www.usphl.com/page/show/2914506-tuition-free-division

Nobody said they were owned by the same people. It says "run."

So, your opinion is that it will be a schedule supplement. Others are saying it's a way of changing the structure of the Fed. Your opinion is no less - or more - valid than anyone else's.

I'm hearing BSB youth teams are not joining, even though they have a Junior team. So, maybe your "fact" that the teams are required isn't "straight."

Bandits already announced they are joining - youth teams too, from what I heard. But Terriers are not.

I see no reason the same people that are running the Fed now can't turn the USPHL into the same cow.

And I don't think PG and TL are so dumb as to "be left in the dark." They will make their own counter-moves. My guess is they will band together and go to the T1EHL, maybe with MF/SF and a couple of other stronger E9 owners to form a MA Division.

BSB is not listed in the new tuition free junior league. From New England, it is IHC, SSK, Bandits, CT Rangers, Jr Bruins and Cyclones.

Are MMF and Jr Bruins affiliated or are the MMF not going to USPHL? In that case, without PC and MMF, it seems like EHF will stay intact or add a few teams to replace the 3 or 4 that left.

stupid question, but why would they move their youth hockey from the EHF? Couldn't they just play USPHL at the junior level and everything else in the EHF? Isn't that what BSB do in the current T3 USPHL?

The rumored explanation is that the youth teams are necessary to pay for the tuition fee junior teams.

And, it's a way of reversing the watering down of talent from too many teams.

MMF and Jr Bruins are affiliated. I would assume MMF would be part of upstart USPHL as well.

Boy am I glad my son is at the end of the youth hockey line. Have fun with this deal you guys with younger kids. Sounds like the same product but for more money.

If IHC and MMF go USPHL leave to giant holes in the EHF geographical territory north and west of Boston. Bandits and SSK already have plenty of competition in their area.

Which teams could takeover North and West? Or would MMF and Jr Bruins stay separate with MMF in EHF and Jr Bruins adding youth teams in USPHL? Would IHC split off another team that stays local in the EHF?

no ehf holes to fill. USPHL teams are adding 3rd teams at all levels. Instead of 2 06 teams in ehf it will be 2 06in ehf and one 06 in usphl (same for all ages). this is how junior team will be funded/and e9 will be taken down.

So, the IHC, MMF, SSK and Bandits EHF tier one teams become EHF elite next season? Bandits and SSK first teams are having trouble competing at most age groups, tough to see how their 2nd teams would handle the EHF elite.

Whats the prediction on when any of this will be announced?

What about the Caps and Falcons and the Vipers... E9 Teams: what about the Warriors and Monarchs

What about them? What is the question?

It really will be elite, I mean elitist, er, only for those who can afford it.

Warriors Junior program is not included in the league. Monarchs is.

It is my understanding the AYHL teams and the E9 teams are going to do something comparable where there will be the E9 schedule with North and South showcases a few times per year.

The Monarchs (U14 and up) currently play in the MDPHL as well as doing T1HL showcases around the country. Not sure which way they will go with current proposal, but my guess is the will move all youth in the USPHL. Since they are new and probably want to be good partners, they will follow suit with the rest of USPHL teams.

It will be really interesting to see what happens to the remaining for pay junior programs.

It is the Rochester Monarchs in the new USPHL division not the NH Monarchs.

Bozo

With USPHL becoming a Tier 2 Jr League ( FREE), it will quickly bring up the skill level of all the lower level teams ( Youth through Elite). In the next few years every Youth and Jr program will want to become a member of this league. This league will be seen as the path/gateway to Eastern College hockey.

The FED will still do fine and perhaps will have a back room arrangement with USPHL as there are many of the same cast of characters involved.

Don't know this for a fact but have a very strong sense.

How come the Caps are not part of the new group if things are all good with the ehf? There is no RI team in the new usphl division, seems like it would have been a natural fit.

That last post just showed your ignorance. They were in it. Couldn't support their teams. And awful and could not draw any talent. They folded the older age groups.

The concept that this will increase the talent level of the youth level is comical. It's all watered down and that's not going to change. The best hockey guys in the area (Lovell's) can't even draw talent anymore.

Also, the league is not approved yet. They have simply filed for the change of status with USA hockey. The ruling will not come down until January. This may not be approved. The economics don't make sense on the East Coast. Not enough ticket sales. If it does pass they will be one year and done

You are talking like there isn't a whole other league out there that will fight for their piece of the youth hockey pie. If the high end talent that sets the EHF Elite division apart now moves over to a smaller group of USPHL youth teams, it will decimate the "EHF Elite" division and create opportunity for that next tier of teams at the top end of the E9. Don't think that the E9 won't counterpunch. Sure they won't be the top league around, but their product might be appealing to an even larger number of customers than it is now.

If only 4 teams leave but are also replaced by adding another level within their organization, there isn't much of a void to fill. EHF will be a little more watered down and E9 will probably be on closer to equal footing.

Disagree. If you take the top 60 players out of the EHF, it becomes a lot weaker league than the E9. Alternatively, take away the top 40 EHF and the top 20 E9 players, send them to USPHL, and you still have an E9 that is stronger than the EHF.

Are these big changes for the youth divisions for next season? Lots of assumptions being made above. I wonder how much of it is true?

Your second assumption is closer to what will probably happen. They will recruit the best E9 players, too - parents won't want their kids to be "left behind," unless the E9 power brokers counterpunch, and soon, by forming four of their own "super teams."

And in the aftermath, the EHF and E9 debate really won't have teeth.

It will be interesting to watch the next couple of months.

BTW, what is laughable is this sense that the EHF is too strong for change. Do any of those thinking so remember the MBHL, circa 2003/2004?

Trust me when I say no one is going anywhere. The youth level is a joke at the USPHL which is why the Bandits are moving there. They have no other option. Buckley runs the Fed so the Caps not letting anyone leave. This is all supplemental hockey. All the teams in that league now also play in other leagues or independent schedules. The crazies on this board are all the ones that think the parents are going to drop 25K a year for you sake.

I agree that the current USPHL youth teams aren't strong. Not sure about them being in other leagues as well. I guess they'll need a couple bigger orgs to join and hope that the rising tide lifts all boats. No idea what you're talking about with the 25k a year.

Seems like a lot of posts with reasonable info that contradict your "trust me no one is going anywhere" response.

Yes, because this is a trusted source of info

you are all missing some information and its clouding your vision. The USPHL is going to run exactly like the EJEPL. Teams will join, for a nice fee, and they will have a supplemental schedule along the like of 12-16 games. The "top" EHF elite teams will play in the USPHL and the Fed. There will not be 3 teams at every level as this is not a 30 plus game league. Most organizations have trouble filling 2 teams never mind a 3rd Super team that doesnt exist. If you want to know more go to the EJEPL website and see how it works.

Except there are 11 teams in the new tuition free junior league. Even if the youth teams only play each other twice, that is 20 games. A full EHF schedule is another 33 games. Thats 53 games before playoffs for either league or any tournaments that some of these high profile teams will want to do.

Playing two full league schedules seems like a stretch to me.

Thank you, Mr. Clairvoyant, for setting us all straight.

Ummmmm, except, no one aspires to be the EJEPL.

RG may be an arrogant pr!ck, like you, but he his far smarter, my friend. He will figure out how to leverage this to create better hockey for MA as well as make $$$ doing it.

thank you and the $10,000 per team the EJ gets is not something to aspire too?? This will demand probably twice that plus a higher yearly team fee. They have no interest in "creating Better Hockey" only creating Deeper pockets. Enjoy paying double while your kid plays againts the same talent they are now with a few extra games thrown in

IHC charges about that for U16 already. So does BA. Neither are in the EJEPL.

I realize you are handicapped by being a youth parent. It's a whole different ball game after Bantams.

Who cares what teams charge their players now and we all know neither of those teams are in the EJEPL. Never said they were so keep being an idiot. I am talking about League Fee's per team not individual fees per player. This thread is about creating a bigger USPHL league and since you have no clue how these leagues actually work you should just stop showing your ignorance. Check out the Models of the EJ and USPHL Youth. they are supplemental Leagues. Every team that plays at the youth level also plays in their own league closer to home. SO get over the "better Hockey" thing. its not and it wont be. Its only there to make more $$ for the men who run the league.

Stop making **** up. There may or may not be truth to your statement but you have no way of knowing. People on here always act as if they know both leagues inside out. And.you.don't.

Sigh.

It's an opinion a$$hat. If you disagree, offer a counter argument. That's how discussions boards work, no?

I bet there are plenty of people on here that have kids in both leagues, or kids who have spent time in each league, that can size up the talent level of both leagues. Many kids on the "elite" teams all skate skills and play tournaments together in the off-season. There's more crossover/interaction between leagues than you think. Once you get to peewee, if you've been in the same league(s) for 6+ years most of the kids know each other, and many parents do too. This has been my experience, maybe it's different for others.

My kid plays on an Islanders elite team. I spoke with RG directly about this. Supplemental only and he's not even sure if the juniors level will actually be voted in to tier 2. As of now no EHF teams have committed at the youth level. So until it's announced settle down big boys.

USPHL application for Tier II was denied by USA Hockey. So business as usual next season or do they not take no for an answer...

So Kings, Islanders, Flames, etc won't be leaving EHF for the USPHL youth division we assume?

Hopefully, they push forward anyway. All of these East Coast players have to go out to the midwest for a year or two just to come back to play college hockey out east. F Them. I would like to hear their reasoning for denying the application that was asking for an opportunity to be heard!

After reading up on it, it looks like it's going to happen one way or another. Either USA Hockey will reverse its decision on appeal, or the USPHL will just leave USA Hockey entirely. Makes you wonder what USA Hockey is thinking. Why would they deny more free-to-play opportunities at the junior level? There's too many crap pay-to-play leagues now, why not deny them?

Probably has more to do with how they figure they are going to make it as free-to-play. Their financial projections probably don't work out. They don't want to start a whole new league just to have it fold because the teams can't support themselves.

Yep!, There is a big difference between starting a league and a league ongoing sustainability.

These owners are wealthy because they are smart businessmen! Obviously a gate would be negligible and maybe a few extra bucks from marketing/ advertising. Charge every other player an extra $300 +/- a year playing Tier 1 youth with the goal of playing Tier 2 Jr's down the road. It is a no brainer! Parents are already spending $5k a year ( min per player) on teams, travel, skills, etc. What is another few hundred a year with that kind of dangling carrot.

Seems fishy to me.

they got denied because they would not meet all the requirements. Like you need to take a bus at the tier 2 level. USPHL teams objected to this because of how close rinks are and it is $1000 per game for the bus. How much billet the charge can be was an issue. also some others.

Buy a couple mini buses ( Great Advertising!) $35k each, Billet fees? Puhlease...

What were the other issues? Common, It makes too much sense to have a Tier 2 League in area where we have the players and the colleges that they will matriculate to.

Because it's not a sustainable business model. The league would fold. Cannot fund through youth programs because people are not willing to pay more so older kids can play for free. Too many other options out there now. The end of the day it was a flawed model from the get-go and USA hockey will not let this happen.

But elite hockey is watered down with tuition players. Need this league to work so i can tell everyone that my kid is premier which is better than elite which is better than select which is better than town.

The stronger programs are going to buy out or force the smaller programs to fold! It is earily similar to the Big Box stores force the mom and pops to fold. It is already happening and it is good for all.

Instead of playing on the River Hawks 1st or 2nd team, you will have a chance on playing on the Islanders 1st or 2nd team. If it doesn't happen you will have the lower level teams to fall back on but will have similar or same resources as the higher level teams ( And the Gear _ don't kid yourself- It matters )

In the end you will pay a little more...So what!! With all of the money we spend on hockey for our kids, a few hundred more is not going to create some sort of Exodus. Besides it is going to become a monopoly and the clear path to Tier 2 Jr Hockey, which now will become the preferred path to college. They will not charge a gate or perhaps will charge for a season league pass for families to come watch their kids play ( home or away). Will help defer league costs! We already pay gate fees to watch or kids play summer hockey, why wouldn't we be willing to pay a few hundred to see our kids play free jr hockey??

The previous poster either has grown kids or is in denial. Either way it is going to happen and will mostly be positive. IMHO.

Well the USHL can have nightly paying gate of 3,000 - 5,000 which no one on the east coast will be able to do. That is enough 'reasoning' for me.