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Re: Judging good D

Anon
Anon
Always seeing posts about “ forwards “ and how many goals or assists they get, how good they are and we’re they may likely go. I know it’s a little easier to quantify a forwards skills at this level with how many points they put up. How about the D ? Is it skating, blocking shots, break out passes, corner battles , D to d play on offensive zone , being consistent in the D zone ? Let’s say they don’t put up points very frequently .
IMO, in the absence of stat tracking you can use gap control as a proxy for many important individual defenseman qualities. If they have good gap control they have to have a lot of supporting skills (skating, angling, hockey IQ, etc.) that have to be good too. It's not a statistic and, yes, it's subjective, but it will drive defensive stats like plus-minus, TOI, and Corsi (which I think is a good defenseman measure) but nobody's keeping track of that level of detail at the youth or high-school level. That's why I suggest a proxy like gap control because it is the foundation of success in those stats if they were being tracked.
Gap control ? Really ?

In thirty years of evaluating players I don’t think I have ever heard he has good gap control as a promising factor.

Re: Judging good D

Anon
Anon
Anon
Always seeing posts about “ forwards “ and how many goals or assists they get, how good they are and we’re they may likely go. I know it’s a little easier to quantify a forwards skills at this level with how many points they put up. How about the D ? Is it skating, blocking shots, break out passes, corner battles , D to d play on offensive zone , being consistent in the D zone ? Let’s say they don’t put up points very frequently .
IMO, in the absence of stat tracking you can use gap control as a proxy for many important individual defenseman qualities. If they have good gap control they have to have a lot of supporting skills (skating, angling, hockey IQ, etc.) that have to be good too. It's not a statistic and, yes, it's subjective, but it will drive defensive stats like plus-minus, TOI, and Corsi (which I think is a good defenseman measure) but nobody's keeping track of that level of detail at the youth or high-school level. That's why I suggest a proxy like gap control because it is the foundation of success in those stats if they were being tracked.
Gap control ? Really ?

In thirty years of evaluating players I don’t think I have ever heard he has good gap control as a promising factor.

Then you have not seen/heard anyone evaluating high end players

Re: Judging good D

parents use points and +/-. scouts dissect the stats and put into context ie. PP points v. 5x5 points. level of competition etc.

D get evaluated the same way. Segmented stats. A first pair D playing 35-45% of the game against other teams top line is not the same as a bottom pair D playing half the time with the same +/- line.

So it depends on the level of evaluation but the answer to your question is it's all important and the more things a D does well the better but that's not always possible. That's why there are PP specialists v. PK. Top pair v. bottom pair.

Now having said that it's a game that you need to score to win so the more offensive the better. Offensive skill is often the differentiator. A highly skilled offensive D man will have for more opportunities to advance, even if a defensive liability. Stay at home D are easier to find.

Re: Judging good D

Funny how - "Stay at home D are easier to find" but at most levels it's what wins games. Solid, predictable, sturdy D who make a good first pass.

The risk taking, offensive minded, weak in their own end is fun to watch but the last thing you want on your youth-to-college team. The only thing that saves them in college and pros is to be paired with a good defensive defensemen and a very good goalie - think: Torey Krug.

Re: Judging good D

anon
Funny how - \"Stay at home D are easier to find\" but at most levels it\'s what wins games. Solid, predictable, sturdy D who make a good first pass.

The risk taking, offensive minded, weak in their own end is fun to watch but the last thing you want on your youth-to-college team. The only thing that saves them in college and pros is to be paired with a good defensive defensemen and a very good goalie - think: Torey Krug.
This....:point_up:

the more they say 'the game has changed' the more you realize some parts never do.

Re: Judging good D

CT Huskies moms know good D when they see it.

Re: Judging good D

Just Sayin'
anon
Funny how - \\\"Stay at home D are easier to find\\\" but at most levels it\\\'s what wins games. Solid, predictable, sturdy D who make a good first pass.

The risk taking, offensive minded, weak in their own end is fun to watch but the last thing you want on your youth-to-college team. The only thing that saves them in college and pros is to be paired with a good defensive defensemen and a very good goalie - think: Torey Krug.
This....:point_up:

the more they say 'the game has changed' the more you realize some parts never do.
No one said it stay at home D are not important. What was said was that they are easier to find. Big difference.

Re: Judging good D

Listen to what Bourque and Pothier say. Someone that will make a tape to tape pass to get out of the zone besides the other intangibles. Also +/- is getting a bit anitquated with advanced statistics similar to MLB W/L for pitches